Hello all!
I am a new member to this message board and also the proud new owner of a P-64.
I ABSOLUTELY love this pistol!
BUT, I have a problem.
It's jamming.
I went for my CCDW permit yesterday and it jammed SEVERAL times on the range. Prior to that I had only ran about 10 rounds of ammo thru it the night before and it jammed twice.
My CCDW instructor had a Makarov (not sure what model) and he told me that I just needed to shoot it more to "loosen" it up and then the jamming should stop.
But also, on my magazine, someone has etched a serial number type of crude etching on it. Could it be maybe this is not the original magazine?
Anyway, I LOVE my little pistol, but I DO NOT like it jamming up like this.
Any information would be appreciated.
Thank's,
Ike
Ammo Jams...
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redfestiva
- Senior member
- Posts: 428
- Joined: December 24th, 2006, 11:47 am
- Location: Dayton,Ohio
Ammo Jams...
Welcome to the forum cartercoike,
The crudley engraved numbers on the magazine is normal on all or most of the original magazines. I have 3 and they all have the engraved numbers. One of them matches the serial # of the pistol. On the jamming issue, lube the feed ramp very well. Make sure you are seating the bullets all the way back when you load the magazines. If you are using Wolf ammo, stop using it, several people say that Wolf won't feed well in a P-64. If all else fails, buy another magazine and try it. Could be your magazine spring is weak. Magazines are only $9.95 plus shipping for after market ones. The forum guys say they work great. I'm sure that some other ideas will be posted as well. Let us know if you get it straightened out. Most P-64 problems are generally simple to fix.
The crudley engraved numbers on the magazine is normal on all or most of the original magazines. I have 3 and they all have the engraved numbers. One of them matches the serial # of the pistol. On the jamming issue, lube the feed ramp very well. Make sure you are seating the bullets all the way back when you load the magazines. If you are using Wolf ammo, stop using it, several people say that Wolf won't feed well in a P-64. If all else fails, buy another magazine and try it. Could be your magazine spring is weak. Magazines are only $9.95 plus shipping for after market ones. The forum guys say they work great. I'm sure that some other ideas will be posted as well. Let us know if you get it straightened out. Most P-64 problems are generally simple to fix.
Ammo Jams...
Hello Carter: Please describe the jams - failure to feed, or failure to eject? What ammunition are you using? Have you done a detailed cleaning? Do the jams happen with each of your magazines?
Ammo Jams...
I'd use Mothers chrome polish on the feed ramp and clean the magazines, then try it again. Later Don
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cartercoike
- Posts: 7
- Joined: March 11th, 2007, 10:50 am
- Location: Kentucky
Ammo Jams...
Hi guy's.
Thank's for all the quick replies!
Yeah, I just noticed while ago that the etching on my mag matched my serial number.
Now on the ammo, the problem is failure to feed, the ammo is lodging crooked and not properly feeding into the barrel.
The ammo I have right now is TCW, made in Russia. Only paid $12.95 for box of 50 shells. Another dealer I know has some (not sure what brand) and is selling them for $23.00 for box of 50.
My CCDW instructor has a dealers license and told me he could get ammo fo $5.00 a box for me.
Have not done a DETAILED cleaning, only the barrel.
Will try and lube the feed ramp and see what happens.
Plus I currently only have one mag.
Thank's,
Ike
Thank's for all the quick replies!
Yeah, I just noticed while ago that the etching on my mag matched my serial number.
Now on the ammo, the problem is failure to feed, the ammo is lodging crooked and not properly feeding into the barrel.
The ammo I have right now is TCW, made in Russia. Only paid $12.95 for box of 50 shells. Another dealer I know has some (not sure what brand) and is selling them for $23.00 for box of 50.
My CCDW instructor has a dealers license and told me he could get ammo fo $5.00 a box for me.
Have not done a DETAILED cleaning, only the barrel.
Will try and lube the feed ramp and see what happens.
Plus I currently only have one mag.
Thank's,
Ike
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cartercoike
- Posts: 7
- Joined: March 11th, 2007, 10:50 am
- Location: Kentucky
Ammo Jams...
Also, I don't think its the spring because I can only get 6 shells into the magizine. The spring feels really tight..
Ike
Ike
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devlinfaust
- Forum supporter
- Posts: 174
- Joined: March 30th, 2006, 5:05 pm
- Location: Knoxville, Tennessee
Ammo Jams...
Cartercoike,
A couple of things come to mind, one of which is it always jamming on the same kind of ammo? I have two P-64's and neither of them like the Hornady stuff, although others on this board have had no problems with that particular ammo.
If you have recently purchased your P-64, although they look very clean on a superficial level, a lot of these were packed wuth a crude oil in their internal parts. Make sure that the pistol is totally cleaned out--very important.
Be surem when you attempt to shoot the pistol, that the magazine is fully inserted. I haven't done this myself, but others who have shot with me, sometimes have not let the magazine get in there all the way--until it is fully seated, which can cause problems.
I haven't heard of any P-64's having habitual jamming problems. I tend to doubt that this is a serious problem (of course if it jams, for whatever reason, at a critical time, then it IS a very serious problem).
If these basic things don't work, get back with the message board. There are many good people here who are much more knowledgeable than I am, who will be glad to help you.
A couple of things come to mind, one of which is it always jamming on the same kind of ammo? I have two P-64's and neither of them like the Hornady stuff, although others on this board have had no problems with that particular ammo.
If you have recently purchased your P-64, although they look very clean on a superficial level, a lot of these were packed wuth a crude oil in their internal parts. Make sure that the pistol is totally cleaned out--very important.
Be surem when you attempt to shoot the pistol, that the magazine is fully inserted. I haven't done this myself, but others who have shot with me, sometimes have not let the magazine get in there all the way--until it is fully seated, which can cause problems.
I haven't heard of any P-64's having habitual jamming problems. I tend to doubt that this is a serious problem (of course if it jams, for whatever reason, at a critical time, then it IS a very serious problem).
If these basic things don't work, get back with the message board. There are many good people here who are much more knowledgeable than I am, who will be glad to help you.
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steve98664
- Member
- Posts: 140
- Joined: December 18th, 2005, 6:17 am
Ammo Jams...
Glad you like your P64. Mine looked like new when I got it out of the box too.
However, they are not new out of the box and you probably noticed that there's not a lot of light oil on the pistol.
The list to get you P64 perfect may be longer than expected.
1st and this is an absolute must, you must clean out the cosmoline out of the pistol. It looks clean, but it has this dried grease is all over in the safety, in the firing pin area, etc. Some guys make a solution and dip their pistol, which is great. However, I have always used an extremely heavy spray down with gun degreasers you can get over the counter. Make sure you don't get it on your grips, it will ruin them for sure!
Remove the slide and grips prior to degreaser use. Don't lose the little grip nut. You can replace it, but is a pain too.
Next, pick a good gun lube you can always buy. I use break free as lube, but there are lots out there and you'll get lots of recommendations here. The newer ones have the advantage of polymers that may do more than just regular oil.
If this doesn't cure your jamming, you can polish the feed ramp, but you shouldn't be removing metal, the black oxide coating may wear away, but you really don't want to sand metal, in my opinion. I heard of someone using a worn pencil eraser and a very, very lightly abrasive material/polishing material. I used a buff pad on my dremel and focused on the sharp transition edges that the round encounters during feeding. Clean excess polish material after buffing.
Next, if the gun still has jamming issues, go through the heavy clean and lube process one more time. The cosmoline will not come off easily. Especially out of nooks like the firing pin and safety area. Drench those. Leave it sit with the degreaser on it and rinse/spray with the degreaser.
Next, if your pistol still jams, it may be a safety issue such as I had. You can follow guides here, or get the minimal work needed done on your pistol by a gun smith. Gunk may still be in the safety or firing pin area and there is plenty of information on how to tear that down correctly to clean it.
Next, remember that the mags have cosmoline in them too. You need to strip them down fully and perform the same clean and lube process as the rest of the gun. They look new, but they are not.
You may want to use the idea of putting the mags or the pistol in a bag while working to prevent losing unreplaceable springs, which I think Norm recommends.
Last, pick the right ammo. There will be tons of recommendations on which ammo is right. You may not bet able to buy the best feeding ammo locally. I tried hornady and american with a lot of failures on mine. I got some S&B and it was fine. I'm not telling you which type, but the easier feeding is Euro/Russian FMJ ammo, not HP ammo. Start with FMJ and once you get that working, try HP ammo. American brands are very precisely loaded and made, good quality, but don't seem to make my 9x18 pistols happiest. Buying online is a pain since you may have to fax your license. Cheaperthandirt has ammo, more expensive than others, but no faxing ID. I gave up and just faxed my ammo out to places like AIM.
Mine was pretty good in my opinion for some time with S&B only. I finally fixed a safety problem and it feeds and fires just about anything. This is not that uncommon and lots of information here on it. Start with the cleaning though, 2x if needed.
Don't try any spring changes until you have it figured out. Many here have written about all kinds of problems and finally mentioned that they have modified springs or something else. The basics will fix most problems on this pistol. Change springs once you have the basic operation down, in my opinion.
If all of this seems like too much effort and not worth it, a surplus pistol may not be for you. I think it is worth it, but I have seen many on GB due to remorseful buyers. Friends of mine tell me it is too much effort. They want to buy a new pistol out of the box, lube it lightly and hear no more about it. I wonder how they clean up theirs.....
However, they are not new out of the box and you probably noticed that there's not a lot of light oil on the pistol.
The list to get you P64 perfect may be longer than expected.
1st and this is an absolute must, you must clean out the cosmoline out of the pistol. It looks clean, but it has this dried grease is all over in the safety, in the firing pin area, etc. Some guys make a solution and dip their pistol, which is great. However, I have always used an extremely heavy spray down with gun degreasers you can get over the counter. Make sure you don't get it on your grips, it will ruin them for sure!
Remove the slide and grips prior to degreaser use. Don't lose the little grip nut. You can replace it, but is a pain too.
Next, pick a good gun lube you can always buy. I use break free as lube, but there are lots out there and you'll get lots of recommendations here. The newer ones have the advantage of polymers that may do more than just regular oil.
If this doesn't cure your jamming, you can polish the feed ramp, but you shouldn't be removing metal, the black oxide coating may wear away, but you really don't want to sand metal, in my opinion. I heard of someone using a worn pencil eraser and a very, very lightly abrasive material/polishing material. I used a buff pad on my dremel and focused on the sharp transition edges that the round encounters during feeding. Clean excess polish material after buffing.
Next, if the gun still has jamming issues, go through the heavy clean and lube process one more time. The cosmoline will not come off easily. Especially out of nooks like the firing pin and safety area. Drench those. Leave it sit with the degreaser on it and rinse/spray with the degreaser.
Next, if your pistol still jams, it may be a safety issue such as I had. You can follow guides here, or get the minimal work needed done on your pistol by a gun smith. Gunk may still be in the safety or firing pin area and there is plenty of information on how to tear that down correctly to clean it.
Next, remember that the mags have cosmoline in them too. You need to strip them down fully and perform the same clean and lube process as the rest of the gun. They look new, but they are not.
You may want to use the idea of putting the mags or the pistol in a bag while working to prevent losing unreplaceable springs, which I think Norm recommends.
Last, pick the right ammo. There will be tons of recommendations on which ammo is right. You may not bet able to buy the best feeding ammo locally. I tried hornady and american with a lot of failures on mine. I got some S&B and it was fine. I'm not telling you which type, but the easier feeding is Euro/Russian FMJ ammo, not HP ammo. Start with FMJ and once you get that working, try HP ammo. American brands are very precisely loaded and made, good quality, but don't seem to make my 9x18 pistols happiest. Buying online is a pain since you may have to fax your license. Cheaperthandirt has ammo, more expensive than others, but no faxing ID. I gave up and just faxed my ammo out to places like AIM.
Mine was pretty good in my opinion for some time with S&B only. I finally fixed a safety problem and it feeds and fires just about anything. This is not that uncommon and lots of information here on it. Start with the cleaning though, 2x if needed.
Don't try any spring changes until you have it figured out. Many here have written about all kinds of problems and finally mentioned that they have modified springs or something else. The basics will fix most problems on this pistol. Change springs once you have the basic operation down, in my opinion.
If all of this seems like too much effort and not worth it, a surplus pistol may not be for you. I think it is worth it, but I have seen many on GB due to remorseful buyers. Friends of mine tell me it is too much effort. They want to buy a new pistol out of the box, lube it lightly and hear no more about it. I wonder how they clean up theirs.....
Last edited by steve98664 on March 11th, 2007, 5:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Ammo Jams...
Steve, you make it sound like a 15-credit class. I don't think it is. Al new pistols need to break in, not just milsurp pistols. Clean it, work it, and it should be fine.
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steve98664
- Member
- Posts: 140
- Joined: December 18th, 2005, 6:17 am
Ammo Jams...
Nbender, you are right, I did. I guess I just never figured anyone would fire a pistol they hadn't already deep cleaned, gotten the cosmo off of. Not something I would do 1st try, but the quality the pistol arrives in can fool someone, someone less experienced with milsurp.
How many threads have you read like this about safety's, springs, etc to find out the owner had not cleaned it? How many threads discussing feeding only to find the owner had modified springs out of the box, but still no cleaning, etc ? How many who have not cleaned the mags because they don't usually do it? I have read a lot that way. You don't know until someone tells you.....
Common sense to you and I is intense maintenance to guys I've met at my range and friends. No insult intended to anyone, especially not CC, with the problem.
How many threads have you read like this about safety's, springs, etc to find out the owner had not cleaned it? How many threads discussing feeding only to find the owner had modified springs out of the box, but still no cleaning, etc ? How many who have not cleaned the mags because they don't usually do it? I have read a lot that way. You don't know until someone tells you.....
Common sense to you and I is intense maintenance to guys I've met at my range and friends. No insult intended to anyone, especially not CC, with the problem.
Last edited by steve98664 on March 11th, 2007, 6:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Ammo Jams...
Lots of good information, there, Steve, and thanks for taking the time to cover the subject in-depth. That's right, also, to say that lots of folks don't grow up around guns and machines and mechanically inclined people to teach them early on, and when they get a semi-automatic hand-gun, it can be a puzzle for a little while. Plus, the language is Greek to many.
American commmercially available handguns come in such different condition than military surplus, which come from armory storage most of the time. It's at the armory that personnel use an electric pencil to match the mags to the pistols upon issue. Mags were not matched to pistols at the manufacturing facility, evidently.
The clear 1 gallon plastic kitchen bag that you can get both your hands and the pistol in is the way to go, for sure, when dissassembling. Don't forget, once you've soaked in solvent to clean the gun, to re-lube properly, especially the slide rails, where a little grease is proper, and the action where a good quality gun oil should be used sparingly, but hitting all the critical points.
American commmercially available handguns come in such different condition than military surplus, which come from armory storage most of the time. It's at the armory that personnel use an electric pencil to match the mags to the pistols upon issue. Mags were not matched to pistols at the manufacturing facility, evidently.
The clear 1 gallon plastic kitchen bag that you can get both your hands and the pistol in is the way to go, for sure, when dissassembling. Don't forget, once you've soaked in solvent to clean the gun, to re-lube properly, especially the slide rails, where a little grease is proper, and the action where a good quality gun oil should be used sparingly, but hitting all the critical points.
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cartercoike
- Posts: 7
- Joined: March 11th, 2007, 10:50 am
- Location: Kentucky
Ammo Jams...
Many thanks to all who replied!
"American commmercially available handguns come in such different condition than military surplus"-That makes A LOT of sense to me. I had never given it any thought, nor actually was I even aware of the history of the P64 until AFTER I bought it.
I will use all the information you guys have provided me with and I am sure from what I have read that this is a temporary problem. That was my main concern. I thought maybe I had just got a bad piece.
But I definately have a crush on this pretty pistol and have NO intentions of getting rid of it!
She's the one for me.
Just gotta give her some love and loosen her up a bit.
Thanks again to all!
Ike
"American commmercially available handguns come in such different condition than military surplus"-That makes A LOT of sense to me. I had never given it any thought, nor actually was I even aware of the history of the P64 until AFTER I bought it.
I will use all the information you guys have provided me with and I am sure from what I have read that this is a temporary problem. That was my main concern. I thought maybe I had just got a bad piece.
But I definately have a crush on this pretty pistol and have NO intentions of getting rid of it!
She's the one for me.
Just gotta give her some love and loosen her up a bit.
Thanks again to all!
Ike
Ammo Jams...
cartercoike
I'm sure I speak for many when I say you are welcome and we are glad to have you on the forum. We hope you will visit and contribute often.
bZinggg.
I'm sure I speak for many when I say you are welcome and we are glad to have you on the forum. We hope you will visit and contribute often.
bZinggg.
Ammo Jams...
The old TCW huh? That stuff is almost historic. It's a precurser to Wolf ammunition. Amazing how that stuff is still out there. It's good ammo, with overall lengths in the range of currently produced 9x18. Anyway, the first step is to try some other brand of ammo.
You know the magazine is supposed to hold 6 rounds?
The other thing to do is get to a safe area, load your magazine, and keep racking rounds through the pistol by working the slide. Point in in a safe direction! and don't fire, just force feed ammunition through it. A lot of pistols need a break-in period; something your instructor alluded to.
You know the magazine is supposed to hold 6 rounds?
The other thing to do is get to a safe area, load your magazine, and keep racking rounds through the pistol by working the slide. Point in in a safe direction! and don't fire, just force feed ammunition through it. A lot of pistols need a break-in period; something your instructor alluded to.
Last edited by nbender on March 11th, 2007, 8:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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papabear
- Global moderator
- Posts: 2080
- Joined: January 22nd, 2006, 1:16 am
- Location: Madisonville, Kentucky
Ammo Jams...
cartercoike,
Welcome aboard, glad to have another Kentuckian here. There's a bunch good info and suggestions about the P-64 here. There's plenty of good help here too if you need it., so come on in and stay awhile.
Papabear
Welcome aboard, glad to have another Kentuckian here. There's a bunch good info and suggestions about the P-64 here. There's plenty of good help here too if you need it., so come on in and stay awhile.
Papabear
POINT SHOOTER