The Unofficial P64 Resource Forum

Quote from NorthBender, "One of these days I'll do a comparison of 9x18 velocities from the Makarov vs the CZ 83 vs a P 64 - hopefully in the Spring."
Its Spring Now !!
I hope you can do that chrono test to see which pistol shoots fastest, based on barrel lengths !! Thanks Man ! I am looking forward to the great Ammo charts you made for the 9x18Makarov round, like that one at gunboards , except a new one for bbl. lengths!
G

Hello Garry:

I think I did more than one comparison between the CZ-83, P-64 and Makarov, but here's what available on my work computer. I posted this last October when the Barnaul Plant came out with Brown Bear FMJ. You can see that the CZ-83 gives a bit more velocity.

***************************************************
October 7, 2006:


I just received some of the new Brown Bear Full Metal Jacket produced by the Barnaul Plant and shot some through my Mak, my P-64, and my new CZ-83 from makarov.com.

I had no failures to fire or feed, and the ammunition seemed accurate. My only complaint is it smokes so much it would give away your position, and that much smoke creates excess residue to clean.

In comparison to the older Brown Bear FMJ produced at the LVE plant, this ammo is a tad bit slower (not by a significant amount); has a lower standard deviation (SD) and extreme spread (ES), and the Overall Length (OAL) is much tighter, which indicates to me better quality control.

I weigh 22 cartridges and pull the lightest and heaviest to measure bullet weight. The magnetic properties are listed to indicate a component contains steel.

Brown Bear 94-gr FMJ (20 rounds tested)

In 2006 the Russian Barnaul plant started exporting Brown Bear 9x18. Older Brown Bear cartridges were produced by the Russian LVE plant.

Manufacturer: CJSC Barnaul Cartridge Plant, Barnaul, Russia
Headstamp: "9mm Mak" with small "JSC" (Russian Cartridge Plants Association) trademark
Cartridge Case: Lacquered steel, Berdan primed, non-corrosive primer
Bullet: 2 weighed: 94.5 and 94.9-grains; steel-jacketed, copper-coated, with concave exposed-lead base
Magnetic: Cartridge case and bullet jacket are magnetic

OAL (ins)
Range: 0.973 – 0.981
Avg: 0.976

20-rounds shot through a 1985 Bulgarian Makarov:

Velocity: (feet per second)
Range: 965 – 1009
Avg: 982
ES: 35
SD: 9

20 rounds shot through a 1973 P-64:

Velocity: (fps)
Range: 927 – 978
Avg: 956
ES: 51
SD: 14

20 rounds shot through a 2006 CZ-83:

Velocity: (fps)
Range: 973 – 1043
Avg: 1009
ES: 70
SD: 24

Awesome ! That is great stuff ! Thanks for sharing this stuff and taking the time to do such a thorough job of it !!! i see there is alot of difference between the barrel lengths making for higher efficiency in the longer barrels ! That really shows just how spring changes effect the cartridge staying in the chamber long enough to build proper pressures to efficiently burn off the powder and springs can really have a big effect on the "timing" of the action !
I will take this info for what it is -- A Fantastic and helpful Chart !!! You are a good man for doing this for everyone ! I knew the barrel length affected the velocity, but to see the numbers is an excellent gauge to go by ! Thanks Again and i will look forward to ,hopefully, more of this type reporting ! G

Garry - thanks for the enthusiastic support!

I'm not sure that spring changes can affect velocities. That's a subject for more learned shooters. I've always thought the barrel length has the most influence on speed for a semi-auto pistol.

NBender, NP, I love reading that kinda stuff. Thanks !!

"I'm not sure that spring changes can affect velocities." ... Me either. It just seems logical that a softer spring would let the slide go back quicker, taking the cartridge case with it,before it gets to expend all the energy,thereby reducing the velocity as the pressure goes both directions. A bolt action locks the bolt and gets better velocities,compared to blowback bolts. So, it would seem to me that, the longer the bolt stays "locked up" behind the cartridge the higher the velocity.
Softer springs would let the bolt go back sooner , letting it lose velocity from lack of back pressure of the bolt lock up. At least that sounds simple to me. Too soft of a spring would let more of the gases escape rearward before the bullet leaves the muzzle? If i am not somewhat correct here, i hope yall will give me the Correct Theory , please ! That just seems logical to me. Please let me know if i am way off guys ! I appreciate all of the work you guys do in this field,so, I hope to see more comments on this ! Thanks Again NBender !!!!! G