The Unofficial P64 Resource Forum

My neighbor has a Remington Rand 45. It has a Bar Sto 45 bbl in it. It also has a 5 digit serial number on it, if that means anything. It is probably 99%, however, it also has on the other side (rt. side) Essex Arms Co.. Does that hurt the value of the firearm or does it matter at all? What would be a close value of the pistole? (I might try to buy it. ;D ) I have looked at some on e-bay but I am unsure of what he has.
Thanks,
Blinddog

Blinddog

its what's called a mix master, it was made up from parts

NORM

blinddog,

If you could post a pic of both sides of the gun it would be nice, but since you don't have it, its hard to tell the value, as Norm mentioned its a mix master and probably not from GI parts, so there is no collection value in it at all, if I had more info I might could give you a ball park value for it.

You mentioned that it has a 5 digit SN, all SN were stamped on the frames and Remington Rand's were only made from 1943 - 1945 and they all had 6 & 7 serial numbers, 5 digit SN came from 1912 - early 1915, There were some Remington UMC 1911 45's [Union Metallic Cartridge Co.] made from 1918 - 1919 and they had some 5 digit numbers, so its not a Remington Rand or UMC frame, if must be a Essex frame, if the slide is stamped Remington Rand on the left side it should read:

Remington Rand Inc.
Syracuse, N.Y. U.S.A.

The Bar Sto is a after market bbl, the Remington Rands normally had bbl's marked "HS" one the upper right side of the lug and a "P" marked on the left side of the lug, some very early '43 RR had Colt .45 Auto marked bbls. and there were some Flannery marked bbls between '44 & '45.

Questions:

Dose the magazine have a letter stamped on the butt plate lip, if it dose it is a WWII period magazine?

You mentioned it was probably 99%, is that the finish, working condition or both? These war time pistols had a parkerized finish, not blued or stainless steel or nickle.

All this said, IMO with the Essex frame or slide, the rest of the 45 components had to be fitted, if I were going to build a 45 with a war time slide and put it on a after market frame I get a Caspian, but then there is on guarantee it would function 100% either, a good gun smith can make em both work but I had rather spend my money and get a good 45 to start with, there are lots of them on the market today, IMO again, the RIA's are as good a .45 for the money as there is on the market, that's my $0.02 worth.

Blinddog,

I have a "Frankengun" with the same combination of an Essex frame and a Remington-Rand slide. I was getting quite a few "flyers" when target shooting due to the loose slide to frame fit (remember that your RR slide is at least 60 years old and probably pretty worn) and sloppy barrel fit. I spent several hours squeezing the slide, hammering the rails, and lapping the slide to frame fit. After tightening up the slide/frame fit, I welded the "GI" barrel to lengthen and widen the "hood" and spot-welded the upper lug groove at the 10 o'clock and 2 o'clock positions to add enough metal to allow fitting the barrel. That, plus a shorter "link" got the barrel to fit quite nicely. The original trigger was also too short for me so I replaced it with a "medium" length one and also put in a better fitting barrel bushing.

The end result is now consistent 2"+/- groupings at 10 yards. More than adequate for my requirements! (Not bad results for about $45 in parts!) It's also taken several hundred rounds of any FMJ and HP ammunition I've run through it without any problems.

It's been a great "practice" gun and I've enjoyed playing around with it but, as far as value goes, it isn't worth much (and never will be) and, quite frankly, I didn't have to pay much for it to start with!

I had the same mix-matched parts gun. We used to buy parts from Essex Arms in Island Pond, VT & Caspian in Hardwick, VT for our rack guns. They and Caspian used to make parts for Colt way back. I bought the Essex arms frame/ Remington Rand slide off my Unit Commander for $100. There is noting wrong with their parts or frames/slides. In fact many custom pistolsmiths use their parts for custom .45s.

You can have the slide/frame fit tightened up. An old Army bullseye shooter in Essex Jct Vt named Bill Wheeler used to tighten up the actions on our competition .45s. Ok so it isn't a collector piece, have fun shooting it. Sgt P.

Thanks for the info guys. The pistole looks good the slide is a dull olive green with blued safety hammer and sights etc. But, the last thing I need is to buy a p.o.c. I told my neighbor I would give him $100 bucks for it. I don't think that he took me serious. I got him back for that P-64 that he customised for me with that Russian made SKS and 1000rds of armour piercing ammo. $350, not shabby.

blinddog

I think he should give it to you for free , but don't let him work on it

NORM

Hey Norm, I don't even let him touch ANY of my guns. When I have one I am working on I don't even tell him. ;D